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Post by diziet sma on Feb 14, 2020 2:17:57 GMT
Just finished the latest episode. So it ends on a cliff hanger...
The last 2 eps have been a bit slow IMHO, so I am hoping the pace picks up a bit.
4 episodes left...
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Post by yankee on Feb 14, 2020 2:58:19 GMT
Given how much screen time they are giving Holly I dont imagine Jack will do her harm, despite what the entity may want him to do.
Perhaps he hopes she can cure him.
It seems Holly is aware he is in league with the entity too and wouldnt go off alone with him if she felt it would put her in danger.
Then again, with as many left turns as this program takes you never know!
They might just go and kill her off.
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Post by geometryman on Feb 14, 2020 9:31:52 GMT
Although she didn't spot his blistered neck until after they were already on their way in the car, and then she immediately tried to abort the journey. But I agree, he hopes she can help him.
They're never going to kill Holly off! She features in other Stephen King novels, which they might want to adapt following the success of this one.
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Post by yankee on Feb 14, 2020 12:56:50 GMT
Oh yes thank you for remimdinging me Geo! I has forgotten that Diziet sma mentioned earlier on that Holly is a recurring character.
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Post by diziet sma on Feb 14, 2020 22:44:48 GMT
I think you're probably right guys, but the other books with Holly were publishd before this one, so it is possible she comes a cropper.
She looked terrified in the final scene though. Is he planning to kill her or do something even worse?
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Post by yankee on Feb 15, 2020 0:20:17 GMT
The entity seems to mainly want the investigation stopped so that is can go on with it's normal killing routine.
Holly was the only one still really trying, still making any progress in solving the murders. Even Ralph seems to have packed it in.
So it makes sense, take out Holly, that pretty much makes it a wrap.
But Jack does seem to have a conscience, is fighting the entity's control.
And they seem to be inserting the Asian woman cop more into the picture and there is some unspoken history with her and Jack.
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Post by geometryman on Feb 15, 2020 8:45:40 GMT
Yes, so there is - that scene the week before when he refused to hold her baby (presumably to protect it) and she was very put out. Hmm...
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Post by yankee on Feb 19, 2020 18:57:14 GMT
So what did you think of this week's episode? I figured I would wait to hear your take/s first. All the major and minor characters really featuring this week. There was a lot going on!
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Post by diziet sma on Feb 20, 2020 3:39:38 GMT
I am not really sure about this episode. Holly and Jacks story was good, but the stuff about the widow selling houses, and suing people wasn't necessary...unless it's key because something happens next week. And the strip club guy has left town I guess, so maybe the evil has moved on.
I have a feeling that there isn't going to be a real satisfying ending. Maybe the book doesn't or maybe they want to leave things open for season 2. I hate it when that happens.
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Post by geometryman on Feb 20, 2020 9:07:51 GMT
I still don't know what Jack intended to do with Holly. Afterwards she considered several things and ended up deciding he was going to get rid of her, but was being forced to against his will. When he was firing at her car as she escaped, he didn't look like he was just trying to stop the car. Having been unable to go through with shooting himself, now what?
(I didn't quite get the thing with Holly's 2 sets of keys - had she anticipated the business at the filling station?)
Yes, looks like he (or his double) is set to be the next murderer, somewhere. Holly was really angry with Ralph for failing to mention he was scratched by the Terry Maitland clone.
I wasn't sure whether Glory was right about the couple she was showing round the house, or whether it was all in her mind and they were genuine customers. Though they weren't asking many questions, so I guess she was right.
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Post by yankee on Feb 20, 2020 15:25:18 GMT
Great observations both of you.
I thought this weeks episode had a theme of "empowerment" from the believers in the entity and they each got up in the face of the non-believers and told them they better wrap their heads around the fact that this is all really happening.
As mentioned above by Geo, Holly confronted Ralph for not telling her that Terry had scratched Claude, especially when she told the group that was how the entity was passed from host to host. Ralph also got dressings down from his wife Jeannie and Yul, the Latino GBI investigator (both believers) over his recent apathy about the case and lack of urgency given Holly's talk to the group. Glory's lawyer Howard got similar reality check from his investigator Alec (a believer).
As for Claude leaving town, that goes with the theme of all the other murders where the host leaves town whilst the doppelganger stays behind to commit a murder, baffling police that someone seen by multiple witnesses right after a murder was also seen by multiple witness hundreds of miles away at the exact same moment. So depending on whether it was Claude or the doppelganger that left town we don't know where the next murder will take place. In the earlier murders the host was out of town when they got scratched by a carrier. Terry in Ohio visiting his father at the care home and the care home worker who passed it on to Terry had gotten scratched by the Latina woman he hooked-up with when he was visiting his brother in New York. Claude seems to be the first person to be scratched while at home.
What was the business with the dining room chair that Jeannie gave to the charity shop? When Ralph noticed it missing she told him not to worry she had ordered a replacement on-line. Did she get rid of the chair because the entity sat in it? Or because it was the chair their dead son used to sit in? She also gave Glory's children all of his old toys. Maybe she was remembering what Holly said about the entity being drawn to pain and figured if she removed things that caused her and Ralph pain - such as their son's possessions - the entity wouldn't visit again?
Regarding Glory, it was obviously too soon for her to return to work, and I didn't believe the reason she gave about needing money to put food on the table because their savings were running out.
Terry was a high school English Literature teacher at a Georgia public school. As such, he would have been a member of the local teacher's union and part of his vesting would be a life insurance policy. Probably one that paid double benefits for a non-natural death, such as being murdered. He probably would have also paid into a pension plan which would transfer to his widow upon his death. Although its possible she couldn't collect on the pension until she reached retirement age. Anyway that's nitpicking some such errors can be overlooked to move the story forward.
Whether the young couple were really house shopping or being looky loos is unclear but Glory's meltdown seemed a bit over the top. Perhaps she is starting to become a believer or she simply has reached her breaking point.
Her decision to move forward with the law suits I saw as her being defiant. She told her boss she refused to move away. That was their home. So maybe she figures if her family is to be the most infamous family in town they will also be the richest family in town. Money can make a lot of people suddenly start to like you and treat you differently.
Like both of you I was baffled by the scenes with Holly and Jack. She started the drive acting normal, then she became terrified by his neck blisters, then as they drove along she became calm and peaceful again, then she freaked out again and decided she needed to escape.
During their long drive to the barn they talked openly and candidly about the entity. Jack asking why it chose him and Holly said because it fed on pain. And Jack is obviously a troubled man.
At one point Jack more or less told her that he would not hurt her, even if the entity told him to. She responded she wasn't very worried as she believes the entity only kills children.
The two sets of keys baffled me too. Holly is driving a rental car. Its been a long time since I rented a car but I don't remember them giving you two sets of keys. And rental car keys are probably stamped with a message that they aren't to be duplicated if she tried to get an extra pair made at the hardware store. And why would she? I didn't understand Holly's nightmare about there only being one set of keys and Jack shooting her. Did she feel guilty for having abandoned him?
When she was driving away, Jack - a trained police marksman - would have shot out the tires if he just wanted to disable the car. He also would have probably been able to hit Holly had he really wanted to. So I think maybe his firing was out of frustration more than wanting to do her harm. He was hurt, crushed. The one person that could help him abandoned him. So he shot out the windows of the car.
He really seemed to want to get her to the barn. I think he believed if she saw where he encountered the entity it might help her rid him of it.
When the truck driver stopped to pick up Jack when he was hitchhiking I though the driver was a goner, but again Jack seems very reluctant to hurt anyone. And he simply got a ride out to the woods. Probably thinking if he isolated himself away from everyone he cant do anyone any harm. And his will to live also prevented him from swallowing his own gun.
When Ralph visited Tamika, the Asian policewoman, she acted very defensive and aloof when he tried to pick her brain about Jack and why he might be acting strangely. Ralph was innocently asking questions, thinking she might have noticed something he didn't, but Tamika's conscience made her think he was prying or knew something she and Jack had been trying to hide, which makes me think even more that she and Jack had an affair and the baby is his. The entity visited Tamika the night of the Christening. Perhaps it was drawn to the pain she felt when Jack would not hold their baby.
Holly's 'boyfriend' has a bit of "creep" factor to him don't you think? He is a retired cop, but he is pretty young. And he is working as head of security for a strip mall in a small Ohio town. I cant recall if he talked much about his back story, but his early retirement and the fact that the only job he seems to have been able to find seems below his station makes you think there was some nasty business. He seems to be mildly stalking Holly, showing up out of nowhere and tracking her to Ralph and Jeannie's house.
Like Diziet I also hope that the plot is not setting up too many cliff hangers for season 2 that leave us frustrated.
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Post by geometryman on Feb 20, 2020 16:54:06 GMT
I'd assumed it was just because the entity had left traces all over it - but your idea is better!
- although it emerged that they weren't heading towards the barn, but in the opposite direction. Unless that was just because of Holly's detour to the filling station, but it was "2 hours in the opposite direction" according to Yunis - big detour!
I think Jack's the daddy, too.
In episode 2 after Tamika had given birth, Jack was there in the hospital, referring to himself as Uncle Jack and saying the baby looked like him and holding it willingly. (This was before he went to the barn and got attacked, of course.)
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Post by yankee on Feb 20, 2020 17:19:23 GMT
Right!!!! I forgot about the hospital scene when the baby was born!
Well noted about them detouring from going to the barn. I missed that. I was thinking it seemed that they had been driving quite a long time.
I couldn't remember how far away from town the barn was but I do recall that when Jack was first given the assignment to go check it out he complained about having to make drive out to the middle of nowhere.
Maybe he was taking Holly to the woods where the entity had him set-up house?
I am not sure how many different highways there are in that particular part of Georgia but what are the odds that the barn and the entity woods were both along the same highway?
When Holly drove off and he hitched a right with the truck driver, the driver let him off right near the woods.
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Post by yankee on Feb 21, 2020 3:58:21 GMT
Last night I watched a film from the late 1990s called "Fallen" with Denzel Washington and the plot was very similar to The Outsider.
In the Denzel film the evil entity was transmitted from host to host instantaneously by a simple touch. And the host could be a human or an animal.
This short clip shows the evil entity being passed between at least a dozen hosts including a cat.
It also knows Denzel (a cop) is tracking it because various hosts have been committed murders and it warns him to back off. It was a lot scarier than The Outsider.
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Post by diziet sma on Feb 21, 2020 16:06:10 GMT
I've seen that movie, but it was a long time ago and I think I've been getting it confused in my memory with the one where Denzil is a paraplegic, solving crimes from his bed (The Bone Collector).
I hadn't thought much about Holly's boyfriend, but now you mention it, he is a bit creepy, so maybe there's a revelation coming there.
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